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	<title>Comments on: Plagiarism, Smagiarism</title>
	<atom:link href="http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/</link>
	<description>Whatever It Is, I&#039;m Against It</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 23 May 2013 16:43:03 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: F. Lee Baily School Kid</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-991</link>
		<dc:creator>F. Lee Baily School Kid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Mar 2010 06:55:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/#comment-991</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Possession is 9/10 of the law.  If I use it, it is mostly mine.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Possession is 9/10 of the law.  If I use it, it is mostly mine.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Alan</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-992</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 15:54:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/#comment-992</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[She didn&#039;t plagiarize, she merely forgot to credit the work she copied. Hmmmm...&quot;I didn&#039;t steal the clothes from the store, I merely forgot to pay for them.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>She didn&#8217;t plagiarize, she merely forgot to credit the work she copied. Hmmmm&#8230;&#8221;I didn&#8217;t steal the clothes from the store, I merely forgot to pay for them.&#8221;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: library chat</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-993</link>
		<dc:creator>library chat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Feb 2010 13:04:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/#comment-993</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Finally, I find plagiarizing of anything -- research, a non-fiction book, or a work of fiction, to be offensive. I don&#039;t understand when people say that creative ideas can&#039;t be stolen, it&#039;s just as bad and I&#039;m disappointed that this girl was not stripped of all her praise and recognition like the Harvard case in the US a few years ago.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Finally, I find plagiarizing of anything &#8212; research, a non-fiction book, or a work of fiction, to be offensive. I don&#8217;t understand when people say that creative ideas can&#8217;t be stolen, it&#8217;s just as bad and I&#8217;m disappointed that this girl was not stripped of all her praise and recognition like the Harvard case in the US a few years ago.</p>
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		<title>By: library chat</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-994</link>
		<dc:creator>library chat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Feb 2010 13:01:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/#comment-994</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;Has it really changed that much in just 10 years?&quot;
YES.

I have to agree with a lot of the points that Techserving You made -- it is different and I think that packaging is part of it.  Information is so readily available now on everything.  Kids know that they shouldn&#039;t plagiarize from the Library&#039;s set of encyclopedias, but their thoughts of copying something from a website, blog, messageboard are very fluid - as if they were just repeating something they heard.

Even so, back when I was in school there were certain feelings about plagiarizing, how if the library only had 3 books on the French Revolution you better make sure you reference your sources because the teacher with 25 other students in your class would know when all the reports came in looking the same.  Today, I think it&#039;s much harder work for the teacher to know when something has been plagiarized -- there are computer programs that they can feed text into to see if it comes up with a hit, but it&#039;s got to be a lot of work.

Finally, I find plagiarizing of anything -- research, a non-fiction book, or a work of fiction, to be offensive.  I don&#039;t understand when people say that creative ideas can&#039;t be stolen, it&#039;s just as bad and I&#039;m disappointed that this girl was not stripped of all her praise and recognition like the Harvard case in the US a few years ago.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Has it really changed that much in just 10 years?&#8221;<br />
YES.</p>
<p>I have to agree with a lot of the points that Techserving You made &#8212; it is different and I think that packaging is part of it.  Information is so readily available now on everything.  Kids know that they shouldn&#8217;t plagiarize from the Library&#8217;s set of encyclopedias, but their thoughts of copying something from a website, blog, messageboard are very fluid &#8211; as if they were just repeating something they heard.</p>
<p>Even so, back when I was in school there were certain feelings about plagiarizing, how if the library only had 3 books on the French Revolution you better make sure you reference your sources because the teacher with 25 other students in your class would know when all the reports came in looking the same.  Today, I think it&#8217;s much harder work for the teacher to know when something has been plagiarized &#8212; there are computer programs that they can feed text into to see if it comes up with a hit, but it&#8217;s got to be a lot of work.</p>
<p>Finally, I find plagiarizing of anything &#8212; research, a non-fiction book, or a work of fiction, to be offensive.  I don&#8217;t understand when people say that creative ideas can&#8217;t be stolen, it&#8217;s just as bad and I&#8217;m disappointed that this girl was not stripped of all her praise and recognition like the Harvard case in the US a few years ago.</p>
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		<title>By: NotMariantheLibrarian</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-995</link>
		<dc:creator>NotMariantheLibrarian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 16:16:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/#comment-995</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I believe a lot of this boils down to a disgraceful sense of entitlement too many youngsters have.  Most of that can be laid at the parents&#039; doorstep - you are so special!  everyone&#039;s a winner!  Sorry but the general public doesn&#039;t have to give a hoot about your brat.  Yes.  Brat.  You can love them all you want but please don&#039;t expect me to care a whit about your overindulged, special, brilliant offspring.  A good kick in the seat of the pants might help more than anything.  Oh wait ... that might damage their self-esteem!

]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe a lot of this boils down to a disgraceful sense of entitlement too many youngsters have.  Most of that can be laid at the parents&#8217; doorstep &#8211; you are so special!  everyone&#8217;s a winner!  Sorry but the general public doesn&#8217;t have to give a hoot about your brat.  Yes.  Brat.  You can love them all you want but please don&#8217;t expect me to care a whit about your overindulged, special, brilliant offspring.  A good kick in the seat of the pants might help more than anything.  Oh wait &#8230; that might damage their self-esteem!</p>
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		<title>By: librarEwoman</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-996</link>
		<dc:creator>librarEwoman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 13:14:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/#comment-996</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In response to I Like Books:

Yes, third graders should cite their sources. I&#039;m not saying that they should learn MLA or APA style, or that their citations should be required to be a particular format. I&#039;m just saying that they should learn to acknowledge the sources of their information. So many times, I watch adults encouraging their kids to copy sources word for word into their report, or to just go online find images to use in their project, without even writing down from where they got the image. This creates the attitude, from an early age, that the source of information, images, etc, is not important, that all information is equal, and that the person who wrote the information or took the photo is not worthy of any acknowledgement. Is this what we want our kids to be learning?

When kids do not begin learning these concepts early, it&#039;s no wonder that plagiarism is rampant in high school and college.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In response to I Like Books:</p>
<p>Yes, third graders should cite their sources. I&#8217;m not saying that they should learn MLA or APA style, or that their citations should be required to be a particular format. I&#8217;m just saying that they should learn to acknowledge the sources of their information. So many times, I watch adults encouraging their kids to copy sources word for word into their report, or to just go online find images to use in their project, without even writing down from where they got the image. This creates the attitude, from an early age, that the source of information, images, etc, is not important, that all information is equal, and that the person who wrote the information or took the photo is not worthy of any acknowledgement. Is this what we want our kids to be learning?</p>
<p>When kids do not begin learning these concepts early, it&#8217;s no wonder that plagiarism is rampant in high school and college.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mr. Professor</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-997</link>
		<dc:creator>Mr. Professor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 05:40:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/#comment-997</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In non-fiction and especially in academic work, outrage over plagiarism makes more sense. A work of history plagiarizing its sources has ignored the rule of scholarship that readers should be able to return to the sources the scholar used. But what reader would want to return to the sources of a novel?

Even acknowledging sources in a novel would seem strange. Many novels are heavily researched, but they rarely have bibliographies. These scandals erupt because of word-for-word borrowings, but that&#039;s not the limit. If a historian writes a book about the French Revolution without citing any sources, it&#039;s plagiarized because it hasn&#039;t attributed its sources. If a novelist writes a historically detailed but fictional story about a romance during the French Revolution without citing sources that were undoubtedly used in researching the novel, then it&#039;s not plagiarized.

How could reading 25 books on the French Revolution and using that information to imbue your novel with detail and atmosphere be a good thing, while borrowing a page or so from another novel be a bad thing? The outrage in alleged scandals like this aren&#039;t based on any consistent notion of plagiarism or theft, which makes them very hard to take seriously.

And you can take my thoughts here to the bank.
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In non-fiction and especially in academic work, outrage over plagiarism makes more sense. A work of history plagiarizing its sources has ignored the rule of scholarship that readers should be able to return to the sources the scholar used. But what reader would want to return to the sources of a novel?</p>
<p>Even acknowledging sources in a novel would seem strange. Many novels are heavily researched, but they rarely have bibliographies. These scandals erupt because of word-for-word borrowings, but that&#8217;s not the limit. If a historian writes a book about the French Revolution without citing any sources, it&#8217;s plagiarized because it hasn&#8217;t attributed its sources. If a novelist writes a historically detailed but fictional story about a romance during the French Revolution without citing sources that were undoubtedly used in researching the novel, then it&#8217;s not plagiarized.</p>
<p>How could reading 25 books on the French Revolution and using that information to imbue your novel with detail and atmosphere be a good thing, while borrowing a page or so from another novel be a bad thing? The outrage in alleged scandals like this aren&#8217;t based on any consistent notion of plagiarism or theft, which makes them very hard to take seriously.</p>
<p>And you can take my thoughts here to the bank.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mr. Professor</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-998</link>
		<dc:creator>Mr. Professor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 05:40:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/#comment-998</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In non-fiction and especially in academic work, outrage over plagiarism makes more sense. A work of history plagiarizing its sources has ignored the rule of scholarship that readers should be able to return to the sources the scholar used. But what reader would want to return to the sources of a novel?

Even acknowledging sources in a novel would seem strange. Many novels are heavily researched, but they rarely have bibliographies. These scandals erupt because of word-for-word borrowings, but that&#039;s not the limit. If a historian writes a book about the French Revolution without citing any sources, it&#039;s plagiarized because it hasn&#039;t attributed its sources. If a novelist writes a historically detailed but fictional story about a romance during the French Revolution without citing sources that were undoubtedly used in researching the novel, then it&#039;s not plagiarized.

How could reading 25 books on the French Revolution and using that information to imbue your novel with detail and atmosphere be a good thing, while borrowing a page or so from another novel be a bad thing? The outrage in alleged scandals like this aren&#039;t based on any consistent notion of plagiarism or theft, which makes them very hard to take seriously.

And you can take my thoughts here to the bank.
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In non-fiction and especially in academic work, outrage over plagiarism makes more sense. A work of history plagiarizing its sources has ignored the rule of scholarship that readers should be able to return to the sources the scholar used. But what reader would want to return to the sources of a novel?</p>
<p>Even acknowledging sources in a novel would seem strange. Many novels are heavily researched, but they rarely have bibliographies. These scandals erupt because of word-for-word borrowings, but that&#8217;s not the limit. If a historian writes a book about the French Revolution without citing any sources, it&#8217;s plagiarized because it hasn&#8217;t attributed its sources. If a novelist writes a historically detailed but fictional story about a romance during the French Revolution without citing sources that were undoubtedly used in researching the novel, then it&#8217;s not plagiarized.</p>
<p>How could reading 25 books on the French Revolution and using that information to imbue your novel with detail and atmosphere be a good thing, while borrowing a page or so from another novel be a bad thing? The outrage in alleged scandals like this aren&#8217;t based on any consistent notion of plagiarism or theft, which makes them very hard to take seriously.</p>
<p>And you can take my thoughts here to the bank.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: CIncinnati NAMjA</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-999</link>
		<dc:creator>CIncinnati NAMjA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 05:17:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/#comment-999</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It would seem to me that the publisher would aslo be liable in some way.  Shouldb&#039;t they pull the book?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It would seem to me that the publisher would aslo be liable in some way.  Shouldb&#8217;t they pull the book?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Montmorency fan</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/comment-page-1/#comment-1000</link>
		<dc:creator>Montmorency fan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Feb 2010 22:16:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2010/02/17/plagiarism-smagiarism/#comment-1000</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;Thank goodness that helicopter parents were not around in the 1940&#039;s. They would have stormed Normandy demanding that the Army stop abusing their precious kids and let the Nazi have Europe.&quot;

If helicopter parents had been around in 1944 and tried to do what you said, Eisenhower and Arnold would have arrested them, confiscated the helicopters, figured out really quickly how to use them, hurriedly retrained a regiment or two of glider troops on how to use them, and deployed them to some operational advantage.

In other words, though I get your drift, they didn&#039;t have helicopters in Normandy in 1944.  &quot;helicopter parent&quot; is an fine an idiom as any in our language, but you can&#039;t mix it with a D-Day metaphor without some cognitively jarring anarchronism (!)  

That being said, your point is relatively well-taken.
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Thank goodness that helicopter parents were not around in the 1940&#8242;s. They would have stormed Normandy demanding that the Army stop abusing their precious kids and let the Nazi have Europe.&#8221;</p>
<p>If helicopter parents had been around in 1944 and tried to do what you said, Eisenhower and Arnold would have arrested them, confiscated the helicopters, figured out really quickly how to use them, hurriedly retrained a regiment or two of glider troops on how to use them, and deployed them to some operational advantage.</p>
<p>In other words, though I get your drift, they didn&#8217;t have helicopters in Normandy in 1944.  &#8220;helicopter parent&#8221; is an fine an idiom as any in our language, but you can&#8217;t mix it with a D-Day metaphor without some cognitively jarring anarchronism (!)  </p>
<p>That being said, your point is relatively well-taken.</p>
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