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	<title>Comments on: Library Schools, Give Us Job Placement Statistics</title>
	<atom:link href="http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/</link>
	<description>Whatever It Is, I&#039;m Against It</description>
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		<title>By: Myron Gainsbrough</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/comment-page-1/#comment-195718</link>
		<dc:creator>Myron Gainsbrough</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Oct 2012 13:37:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/?p=1497#comment-195718</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Honestly, it&#039;s not that difficult. Any competent person can utilize and search database (and Google), look up books on pardon requests, request a storytime, check out a book, re-shelve the same, and make a budget. Come on people! :)

Myron]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Honestly, it&#8217;s not that difficult. Any competent person can utilize and search database (and Google), look up books on pardon requests, request a storytime, check out a book, re-shelve the same, and make a budget. Come on people! :)</p>
<p>Myron</p>
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		<title>By: Placement</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/comment-page-1/#comment-162275</link>
		<dc:creator>Placement</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 12:15:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/?p=1497#comment-162275</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[They should also count underemployment.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They should also count underemployment.</p>
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		<title>By: Kate Lang</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/comment-page-1/#comment-158649</link>
		<dc:creator>Kate Lang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Aug 2012 00:33:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/?p=1497#comment-158649</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I went to R*tgers and the stuff the faculty did was clearly incompetent. No one else seemed to care that the head of the department had a PhD from an unaccredited diploma mill in the West Indies. ALA didn&#039;t, I emailed them about it during the recent re-accreditation. 

I took an online multimedia class - I&#039;ll never take an online class again. The professor got his PhD in TX studying.. Second Life. I actually that kiss of death art degree, so I took the class as an easy A. It was. Because the professor didn&#039;t actually show up to comment or lecture. One week he went to a tech conference and couldn&#039;t get online to give us our assignment. AT A TECH CONFERENCE THERE WAS NO INTERNET. He told us everyone gets an A for trying. I made the worst crap I&#039;ve ever made on purpose, no feedback and an A. No one knew any better, I&#039;d secretly email people when they mispronounced a word in their presentation videos that was specific to multimedia to save them future embarrassment.  He made 3 &quot;lectures&quot; of 20 min each and that was it. For $2000 in state tuition. And he kept telling everyone to use Fireworks. My friend and I started thinking he got a commission. Who uses Fireworks when you have Photoshop and Illustrator? Fireworks is for web graphics, not print!

I have a lot more complaints including projects that utilized statistics that libraries don&#039;t keep so we all had to make it up, sexist professors (toward women)- one laughed in my face at a serious question. I had to email someone in the Princeton Library to get an answer. However, I could go on and on.

Students can&#039;t demand more. What are we going to do? Complain to the dean? They know it&#039;s going on, it will only come back to bite us in the ass in our grades. We&#039;re there for 2 years and then out.

There&#039;s nothing we can do, but keep our mouths shut, take it, get our degree, and get out of there.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I went to R*tgers and the stuff the faculty did was clearly incompetent. No one else seemed to care that the head of the department had a PhD from an unaccredited diploma mill in the West Indies. ALA didn&#8217;t, I emailed them about it during the recent re-accreditation. </p>
<p>I took an online multimedia class &#8211; I&#8217;ll never take an online class again. The professor got his PhD in TX studying.. Second Life. I actually that kiss of death art degree, so I took the class as an easy A. It was. Because the professor didn&#8217;t actually show up to comment or lecture. One week he went to a tech conference and couldn&#8217;t get online to give us our assignment. AT A TECH CONFERENCE THERE WAS NO INTERNET. He told us everyone gets an A for trying. I made the worst crap I&#8217;ve ever made on purpose, no feedback and an A. No one knew any better, I&#8217;d secretly email people when they mispronounced a word in their presentation videos that was specific to multimedia to save them future embarrassment.  He made 3 &#8220;lectures&#8221; of 20 min each and that was it. For $2000 in state tuition. And he kept telling everyone to use Fireworks. My friend and I started thinking he got a commission. Who uses Fireworks when you have Photoshop and Illustrator? Fireworks is for web graphics, not print!</p>
<p>I have a lot more complaints including projects that utilized statistics that libraries don&#8217;t keep so we all had to make it up, sexist professors (toward women)- one laughed in my face at a serious question. I had to email someone in the Princeton Library to get an answer. However, I could go on and on.</p>
<p>Students can&#8217;t demand more. What are we going to do? Complain to the dean? They know it&#8217;s going on, it will only come back to bite us in the ass in our grades. We&#8217;re there for 2 years and then out.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s nothing we can do, but keep our mouths shut, take it, get our degree, and get out of there.</p>
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		<title>By: Tired Librarian</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/comment-page-1/#comment-158617</link>
		<dc:creator>Tired Librarian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Aug 2012 20:49:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/?p=1497#comment-158617</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The only thing sadder than library school placement rates is being a &quot;volunteer&quot; librarian when you supposedly have a law degree. That and obsessing about the evil perfidy of ALA on the slightest excuse.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The only thing sadder than library school placement rates is being a &#8220;volunteer&#8221; librarian when you supposedly have a law degree. That and obsessing about the evil perfidy of ALA on the slightest excuse.</p>
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		<title>By: Randal Powell</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/comment-page-1/#comment-158034</link>
		<dc:creator>Randal Powell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jul 2012 22:51:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/?p=1497#comment-158034</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree that a person can research and find authoritative information without a MLIS.  In fact, I think that public and academic library directors should view information literacy as a major part of their job.  I don’t think the public has really gotten good instruction on how to do good general research.

Jack may or may not be an expert on how to find all kinds of information, but few others are.  He may or may not be able to write a good, professional research paper, but few others can.  Even if he can, he does not have a breadth of knowledge in every specific domain, is not going to spend all of his time giving other people guidance and instruction on how to find the specific kinds of information they need, and is not going to catalog, store, and maintain millions of books and journals a year and provide facilities and services so that people like him can conveniently access them.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree that a person can research and find authoritative information without a MLIS.  In fact, I think that public and academic library directors should view information literacy as a major part of their job.  I don’t think the public has really gotten good instruction on how to do good general research.</p>
<p>Jack may or may not be an expert on how to find all kinds of information, but few others are.  He may or may not be able to write a good, professional research paper, but few others can.  Even if he can, he does not have a breadth of knowledge in every specific domain, is not going to spend all of his time giving other people guidance and instruction on how to find the specific kinds of information they need, and is not going to catalog, store, and maintain millions of books and journals a year and provide facilities and services so that people like him can conveniently access them.</p>
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		<title>By: Penny</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/comment-page-1/#comment-157962</link>
		<dc:creator>Penny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jul 2012 15:43:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/?p=1497#comment-157962</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[ALA accredited MLS programs do have to account for their placement stats, but I don&#039;t know how significant a factor they are when it comes to accreditation review. Law schools not only track placement #s but bar exam passage rates.  There is no national exam for librarians (which could be argued that librarianship is not a profession, but I am sure that was a previous column in AL.) Not once has my school asked me if I am working in the profession or the type of job I have.  I am not sure how many programs have a separate office for career development and placement (like MBA programs have) but I would guess that most do not.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ALA accredited MLS programs do have to account for their placement stats, but I don&#8217;t know how significant a factor they are when it comes to accreditation review. Law schools not only track placement #s but bar exam passage rates.  There is no national exam for librarians (which could be argued that librarianship is not a profession, but I am sure that was a previous column in AL.) Not once has my school asked me if I am working in the profession or the type of job I have.  I am not sure how many programs have a separate office for career development and placement (like MBA programs have) but I would guess that most do not.</p>
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		<title>By: Jack</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/comment-page-1/#comment-157762</link>
		<dc:creator>Jack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jul 2012 12:41:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/?p=1497#comment-157762</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Perhaps some of you didnt seem to get that I was talking about the staff, not the &quot;stupid&quot; patron archetype that many of you play off of to justify your overpriced degrees as making you supermen of information.

&quot;Well I find the &quot;accurate&quot; information&quot;. Well congrats!

I easily do the same searching that sheep-skinned librarians do. Why? Because I got some simple training and practice. I also find the &quot;accurate&quot; information as well. I just dont get paid an over-inflated salary and moan about being scammed because I wasnt smart enough to read up on the job prospects of a degree path before I blew money on it.

So yes, you indeed need better PR people if you are going to keep duping the public or whomever into thinking that you are these amazing intellectuals and indispensable &quot;information ninjas&quot;, because the public is quickly catching on that what you do is not rocket science.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps some of you didnt seem to get that I was talking about the staff, not the &#8220;stupid&#8221; patron archetype that many of you play off of to justify your overpriced degrees as making you supermen of information.</p>
<p>&#8220;Well I find the &#8220;accurate&#8221; information&#8221;. Well congrats!</p>
<p>I easily do the same searching that sheep-skinned librarians do. Why? Because I got some simple training and practice. I also find the &#8220;accurate&#8221; information as well. I just dont get paid an over-inflated salary and moan about being scammed because I wasnt smart enough to read up on the job prospects of a degree path before I blew money on it.</p>
<p>So yes, you indeed need better PR people if you are going to keep duping the public or whomever into thinking that you are these amazing intellectuals and indispensable &#8220;information ninjas&#8221;, because the public is quickly catching on that what you do is not rocket science.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Kleinman of SafeLibraries</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/comment-page-1/#comment-157715</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Kleinman of SafeLibraries</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jul 2012 07:03:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/?p=1497#comment-157715</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;But if they were honest and open, we’d be getting some numbers.&quot;

FYI, I have made that same observation when the annual list of the top 10 most challenged books comes out.  They don&#039;t give the numbers.  The reality is the numbers are so low the list would not be newsworthy in the slightest.  In 2010 the top book was challenged, all year, all across the USA, a whopping 4 times.  Oh the text said dozens of times, but that was fluff; it was just 4.  Top of the list of 10 books was challenged only 4 times.  Big deal.  People challenge anything these days, like law schools with misleading job placement statistics.  That doesn&#039;t make it newsworthy.

And the ALA doesn&#039;t even count crimes in libraries, or numbers of librarians filing sexual harassment suits, etc.  If you don&#039;t count them, they don&#039;t exist.  Isn&#039;t that a Six Sigma standard?  &quot;Measure key aspects of the current process and collect relevant data.&quot;   Not measuring key aspects means you&#039;re not interested in collecting data -- that&#039;s way we all hear the total number of challenges each year and nothing about library crimes affecting librarians--or about library jobs--they reveal what they care about and what they could care less about.  Us librarians (I&#039;m a volunteer one), they could care less about us being harmed on the job, but they need us to submit book &quot;banning&quot; incidents.  Those books, every last one has to be counted, and in the aggregate, but not revealed in the annual top 10 list.

So if ALA is not providing job placement statistics, it simply means they don&#039;t care.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;But if they were honest and open, we’d be getting some numbers.&#8221;</p>
<p>FYI, I have made that same observation when the annual list of the top 10 most challenged books comes out.  They don&#8217;t give the numbers.  The reality is the numbers are so low the list would not be newsworthy in the slightest.  In 2010 the top book was challenged, all year, all across the USA, a whopping 4 times.  Oh the text said dozens of times, but that was fluff; it was just 4.  Top of the list of 10 books was challenged only 4 times.  Big deal.  People challenge anything these days, like law schools with misleading job placement statistics.  That doesn&#8217;t make it newsworthy.</p>
<p>And the ALA doesn&#8217;t even count crimes in libraries, or numbers of librarians filing sexual harassment suits, etc.  If you don&#8217;t count them, they don&#8217;t exist.  Isn&#8217;t that a Six Sigma standard?  &#8220;Measure key aspects of the current process and collect relevant data.&#8221;   Not measuring key aspects means you&#8217;re not interested in collecting data &#8212; that&#8217;s way we all hear the total number of challenges each year and nothing about library crimes affecting librarians&#8211;or about library jobs&#8211;they reveal what they care about and what they could care less about.  Us librarians (I&#8217;m a volunteer one), they could care less about us being harmed on the job, but they need us to submit book &#8220;banning&#8221; incidents.  Those books, every last one has to be counted, and in the aggregate, but not revealed in the annual top 10 list.</p>
<p>So if ALA is not providing job placement statistics, it simply means they don&#8217;t care.</p>
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		<title>By: Mandalynn252</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/comment-page-1/#comment-157671</link>
		<dc:creator>Mandalynn252</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jul 2012 23:42:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/?p=1497#comment-157671</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Agree with Michelle. At my library job, I end up teaching a lot of people how to use the resources they COULDN&#039;T afford without libraries. Databases and good quality information aren&#039;t cheap! Not everyone is competent in searching for quality information. Not saying that the degree is completely necessary to do a library job. You could learn how to do all those things with a few simple classes. I have one more year with my MLIS, but I&#039;m not going into libraries. I am pursuing technology. Hopefully I will be able to find a job once I&#039;m done. Best of luck to everyone out there looking!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agree with Michelle. At my library job, I end up teaching a lot of people how to use the resources they COULDN&#8217;T afford without libraries. Databases and good quality information aren&#8217;t cheap! Not everyone is competent in searching for quality information. Not saying that the degree is completely necessary to do a library job. You could learn how to do all those things with a few simple classes. I have one more year with my MLIS, but I&#8217;m not going into libraries. I am pursuing technology. Hopefully I will be able to find a job once I&#8217;m done. Best of luck to everyone out there looking!</p>
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		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/2012/07/25/library-schools-give-us-job-placement-statistics/comment-page-1/#comment-157654</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jul 2012 20:42:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lj.libraryjournal.com/blogs/annoyedlibrarian/?p=1497#comment-157654</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;Satisfaction?&quot;  That and a nickel will get you a cup of coffee, as they used to say.  Librarianship is being killed by its own breeding machine.  I recall being told at my orientation, &quot;You will certainly work as librarians--the market is booming.&quot;  I work now but not as a librarian.  My library school training was quite valuable to me, really the capstone of to previous work.  Young librarians: look elsewhere.  Your profession isn&#039;t going to help you.  In fact library leadership continues its silence on the over-stuffing of the schools.  They are part of the problem.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Satisfaction?&#8221;  That and a nickel will get you a cup of coffee, as they used to say.  Librarianship is being killed by its own breeding machine.  I recall being told at my orientation, &#8220;You will certainly work as librarians&#8211;the market is booming.&#8221;  I work now but not as a librarian.  My library school training was quite valuable to me, really the capstone of to previous work.  Young librarians: look elsewhere.  Your profession isn&#8217;t going to help you.  In fact library leadership continues its silence on the over-stuffing of the schools.  They are part of the problem.</p>
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